[Nmcaver] Sandia Grotto Proposes a 2011 NM NSS Convention

[Stephen Fleming]

linda starr wrote:
> The SG has decided to make a preliminary proposal noting SWR 
> endorsement, support and participation has been requested.

While I am neutral regarding the Sandia Grotto proposing to host an NSS 
Convention, I think you are making large assumptions concerning SWR 
interest or support at this point. While you believe you need to act 
without delay due to perceived Colorado competition, implying that the 
SWR 'may' approve by including a teaser that regional 'support and 
participation has been requested' is a step beyond your purview.


> We feel, however, that it has become important to "jump the gun" slightly

With respect to your inclusion of the SWR in your proposal, you have 
more than jumped the gun.


> We decided to announce our plan to the region at the Spring SWR after 
> we had more information to round out the proposal.

Despite the perceived urgency, you have put the cart before the horse. 
If you want SWR support you need to get that first, and certainly before 
you start leading the NSS to believe you have more support than is the 
case at present.

>     At the January 29th Sandia Grotto meeting, a motion to authorize 
> the Sandia Grotto convention proposal be made to the BOG passed by a 
> solid majority.

Was there any discussion by your group of how you are preemptively 
involving the SWR without approval? How do you reconcile speaking for 
the region in your proposal with your lack of regional approval to do 
so? The fact that you feel an urgency to act, does not mean you can 
ignore the SWR processes for obtaining concurrence (or perhaps not 
getting it, depending on how the vote goes).

> Incidentally, the NSS does not vote to accept or reject convention 
> bids at the same meeting as the initial proposal.  We will be refining 
> our proposal for a presentation at the 2007 Convention in Indiana and 
> the BOG will vote at this time if no other proposals are forthcoming.

Which is precisely why you cannot make implications about the SWR at the 
BOG meeting, and why you have plenty of time to properly approach the 
regional for support. I suggest you take out whatever verbage concerning 
the SWR you were planning on using, and make your proposal to the BOG on 
the strength of your grotto, for the time being. Regional support for or 
against your proposal is not a significant factor in the convention 
bidding process. What is important is whether your group has the 
*resources, skills, expertise and ability* to run a convention; not how 
many groups think your plan is good. There was a certain convention in 
Missouri where all the outside support in the world did not change the 
fact that the group in charge was completely incompetent. What would you 
do in the event the SWR denies your request that it be involved? The BOG 
likely would then look unfavorably on expressed non-support after you've 
led them to believe you had it. Make your case individually first. 
Putting the SWR in the trick bag is not a way to advance your agenda.


> We would like to have time devoted at the Spring SWR to present the 
> Sandia Grotto-hosted 2011 NSS Convention proposal to the Region and 
> ask for Region endorsement.

You need to be contacting the SWR leadership to make sure this happens. 
The fact that you do not mention anywhere in your post that you have 
coordinated in any fashion with the SWR is a glaring omission. Why has 
this important step not been already done? Even so, the leadership lacks 
the authority to grant your wish for support without concurrence by the 
membership, but the apparent lack of coordination is troubling. The 
timing of regional events with respect to your bidding agenda may be 
inconvenient, but hoping that a broadcast to a majority of cavers about 
your plans will produce support and/or sympathy does not replace the 
need to go through the SWR motion-and-vote process first.

With the exception of what I am commenting on above, it does appear the 
grotto has placed some thought and effort into the proposal. Make it a 
complete product by doing all of it right with respect to the SWR.
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